That depends...gameplay-wise it sure isnt, I just took it as an example of a bigger-scale ctf map.



Quoted for it summarizes what I want to say.

ctf_well is just awful but that's a different matter.

Turbine is brilliant, accept it a good solider or demoman can get to the center and consider the intel capped, esp demo can jump from the door to the walkway on the other side, straight in the vents = win

I just think it's quite a good map all round. I can't think of a class that would have an inherent weakness on this map. The only problem i used to have with it was when a team used to get penned in by stickies, but it's usually pretty easy to fight your way out. The centre can be utter mayhem, I love it

my memories of turbine were games that always ended with one team being smart enough to get a couple of sentries up in the middle section and the opposing team just lemming it into the sentries constantly

That is exactly the problem, dont u see? Its a map that favors allready "overpowered" classes without leaving routes/niches for classes that need them like spy, scout & pyro.

It's way too easy to lock down the intel room (1man job), the halls and tunnels are heaven for soldier-/demo-spam and the center doesn't leave much room to take cover.
Plain awful.

Guess this is not leading anywhere.

Lol true that it doesn't seem to be leading anywhere but...

Pyro is really good on turbine....he can dodge around behind the containers so soldiers etc lose line of sight, the vents are his playground etc.

It's really easy for spy to get into enemy base, (cloak at ur doors, decloak in their base) and there are loads of positions for him to decloak and wreak havoc. The amount of times I've capped the intel with the spy on this map is quite funny

Scout is the number 1 intel capper on this map as well as being mobile enough to cause lots of trouble in the centre. Once the intel room has been cleared out it's easy for him to get in and grab it and then all that's left is to dodge liek ehll in the centre

I like well. But I think I like turbine even more! Nice choice Valve .

You say that but a good demo can run the intel on most maps faster then any scout, 2fort fly to the sniper bit with ease, well can fly over the crates and throu the door, does this make them bad maps?

Imo these tactics are legit, good tactics, and should be used, TF2 ctf is wrong anyway, 60secs to return? i mean what the... maybe im just to old and miss playing CTF the way it was ment to be played back in quake days, of flying about with a hook and if ya touched ya flag it returned.

I stop ranting and rambling now

I think 60 secs is just fine. That means you have to really defend it untill it returnes.

But its not CTF, its kill em and wait Slows the game down, don't like slowing down